Who should be awarded '04 BCS title if USC is stripped?
Thu May 20, 2010 12:12 PM EDT
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Who should be awarded '04 BCS title if USC is stripped?
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Split the title between Auburn and OU. They were the only two undefeated teams (not counting the title game loss to USC).
Check your facts. Utah was 12 -0 and just crushed Pitt in the Fiesta Bowl (BCS Bowl). Urban Meyer was the coach and went to Florida. They turned around and crushed Bama the in 2009 Sugar Bowl. So its not like they didn't have players.
"crushed Pitt"... which doesn't prove anything.
AUBURN!
How 'bout we find all those players from the unbeaten teams (OU, Auburn and Utah) and bring them back to have a winner take all tournament (maybe double elimination). Wouldn't that be fun. I'd pay to see that.
The whole BCS bowl process is a joke anyway. It's not based on who the best teams really are, it's basically just a popularity contest. The problem is bigger than USC. The system needs to be rebuilt. We need to go to a true playoff system.
Auburn should have been in the title game instead of Oklahoma anyway. They played in a far superior conference, had 3 first round draft picks in the backfield, and the best scoring defense in the country (11 points per game.) The Sugar Bowl was 16 to 0 until the 4th quarter.
They would have been in the game except they paid Oklahoma not to play them in their scheduled game that season and picked up Citadel instead. If they had played that game as planned, would there have been any question?
Bowling Green bought out of the AU game 4 months prior to the start of the season b/c of they were going to play OK. AU was forced to replace them with the best available. Unfortunately it wasn't a tougher opponent. As an AU grad who attended 10 of those wins that year, I would of loved to have seen an AU-USC title game but it didn't happen. I say vacate the title and move on.
Auburn" They scored only 16 points agains VT....Are you kidding?
Why strip the title from USC? Should all the players who played and earned a championship while having had NO part on any of this be penalized?
If USC is stripped, no other team should be awarded the title, simply because you can't go back in time to replay the Championship game.
Read my post below. Nuff said.
Btw Leinart and Bush and company went to Va. Tech and escaped with their lives as a heavy favorite. Be nice to Va. tech
Since the title is mythical and not won in a playoff form, give it to whom ever finished second in the balloting, the BCS is just like Miss America, if the winner is found to not be worthy, it goes to the runner up
Wow. what a bunch of HorseS---! Reggie Bush should lose the Heisman. USC should lose the title, probation for 2 years, loss of scholarships and no Bowl game for a year. I guess we're all seeing now why Petey left in such a hurry. What a complete slimebag as is Reggie Bush. No way his parents could afford that place and God knows what else they got. USMC, what are you thinking??? Former military?? Really?? Are you not familiar with military justice??? One guy can take you all down?? T H E R E is no I in T E A M !! So is ANY good player exempt from the rules the rest endure? I think not. Auburn should get the title. Oklahoma didn't belong there and USC wasn't that good nor was Oklahoma that bad. Above all else, USC should burn for all the crap they pulled. Go down screamin!
To John-351853:
If you believe USC is the only team in the country with bought players, than you have a valid point. But if you realy think about what all the major programs do to bring some of their palyers to their Universities than I guess my point is not valid.
USMC I completely agree that there is enough nonsense that goes on all over the country to keep us all busy for years. I get that. I was referring to to the fact that establishing responsibility to your teamates is the bottom line for all of your actions on and OFF the field. I vividly remember "no man left behind" in a very painful way. That's war, this is college sports. Team still means the same. You don't sell out your teamates ever. Pete Carroll not only sold out USC, last I heard he was driving north to another job. How sleezy is that? This isn't even close to done. The FBI is involved along with the IRS. I'd want to be somewhere else. It's a shame that a proud school is taking it on the chin over the actions of a few, but if reports I've read are true, THEY knew what was going on. Check this out. This is ugly. http://sports.yahoo.com/top/news?slug=ys-uscprobe051209 Sorry if I offended you but this really makes a joke of "college" sports.
USMC, no one thinks that all programs are perfectly clean, but there is a qualitative difference between a booster arranging a no-work job that pays a player a few thousand bucks over the course of a year (remember, players get no spending money as part of their scholarship and many come from destitute families) and a booster who gives a half million dollar home to the family of a player (not to mention probably a boatload of cash).
It has been clear for some time that USC has compliance problems across the board in its athletic department. Most reasonable sports fans don't expect perfect compliance, but they do consider it unfair if there is not only no attempt at compliance but also flaunting of the rules.
To LogicalConsideration:
Lets be realistic and honest here.........this type of compsnsation happens throughout the country at all major colleges, if the NCAA wanted to crack down, they could...except for one major problem, they would only hurt their own interest since the revenue that is generated goes right to their bottom lines.
I am not making excusses for USC or Regiie Bush, I am simply pointing out the obvious. Which by the way, I think everyone is aware of this issue.
Yes colleges cheat/fudge. Yes that happens, no doubt. But I have never heard of anything on a scale like this that involved hundreds of thousands of dollars that resulted in millions of dollars in windfall profits for a school. I could be wrong but I don't think so. Where would you draw the line? $100.00 - $100,000.00? Where would that be? How much competitive advantage? That's like having a pro league with no salary cap for one team and everyone else is limited to $10,000.00. Not exactly a level playing field. The best teams money can buy are in the NFL or so I thought.
I am with John. The scale of this is far beyond what I assume prevails across the country.
The reason it has gotten to the point that you state is because of a lack of enforcement/turning a blind eye to the so-called major programs for decades. It will definitely hurt for a while, but it should be done to send a message like hasn't been done since SMU got the death penalty. This isn't any different than the mentality of corporations being "too big to fail". No program should be too big to go down if they are caught cheating, especially this blatantly. I remember a booster named Logan Young that got Bama into all kinds of crap because the university failed to corral him. The only way to clean up the crap is to come down on violations like a sledge hammer, or change the rules regarding player compensation. The NCAA has been reticent to do either, much to the detriment of college football. JMHO.
For you to make such a statement "that this goes on in every college footbal program is truly insane. You have absolutely zero (0) facts to backup such a statement. Be careful with your comments, because your mouth is writing checks it can't cash.
Oklahoma should be awarded the National Championship if we are stripped. They would have the higher rating and... it Oklahoma!
I respect your opinion, but Auburn was better and to be perfectly fair, share it with Utah. No losses. Can't count them out. They annihalated Bama in 09 so its not like they can't play with the big boys.
Oh and I forgot. That same year they were 12 -0 and crushed Pitt in the Fiesta Bowl.
Enough crying for Auburn. They played USC in 2002 and 2003, and lost both times, being shut out 23-0 at home. they would've lost too. To give Auburn the national title simply rewards them for not playing USC. We're supposed to be impressed with you beat Bryan Randall and Virginia Tech, or cause its in the SEC, which went 3-3 in their other bowl games? Not overly impressive. ESPN will thump for Auburn cause they're in the SEC and they have a big contract with them, but the reality is this: either OU and Auburn split the national title or nobody gets it. OU shouldn't be punished because they, not Auburn, played USC, a team that cheated.
I get your logic...kinda post facto justice for OU. Yes they got cheated but they also got their butts kicked from too many mistakes. Mistakes they hadn't made all year.....just a bad day at the office and the final score showed the shell-shock from those mistakes. But you just cannot rule out Utah. 12 -0 and hammered Pitt in a BCS bowl. Seems fair to split the title between Utah and Auburn. That's just me though. I agree with the Eastern Sports Propaganda Network and proud thumper for the SEC. Hell CBS is worse than that with the SEC.
And Auburn was scheduled to play Oklahoma and bought their way out of that game. Since we don't know who would have won that game, the title should go to OK.
Funny, I thought that OU paid Houston to back out of the game scheduled with Auburn, leaving them no other choice than to play The Citadel, because no one else had an open date with such short notice.
To bojangles247...
USC beating Auburn in 2002 and 2003 has nothing to do with 2004. In 2002, a 9-4 Auburn team lost AT USC in the last 90 seconds of the game. USC would go on to be 11-2. So a 9-4 team lost by a TD on the road to an 11-2 team. In 2003, USC would split the title at 12-1. Auburn was a disappointing 8-5, losing to LSU by a larger margin. All of that is completely irrelevant to 2004.
And to Aubnoxious....
Get your facts at least in the ball park of correct...Auburn was never supposed to play Oklahoma in 2004. They were going to play Bowling Green. At the last moment, BG opted out of the contract (in August) in order to play Oklahoma, who was promising them more money. Auburn was stuck and could only find the Citadel to fill the schedule at the last minute.
And to USMC-Ret....
Are you seriously putting down the Auburn win over a 10-2, #8 VaTech because it was 16-0 in the 4th quarter and ended 16-13? USC beat 4-7 Stanford that year 31-28! Three point win over a 4-7 team! They also beat a 7-5 Oregon State 28-20. Then they ended their year with a 29-24 win over 6-6 UCLA.
Utah was a good team that year too, no question, but don't forget, they did give up 21 points per game...and to teams like Wyoming (28 pts), Air Force (35 pts), Colorado St (31 pts), etc. Not exactly the stiffest of competition.
Even though I'm an Auburn fan, my stance is that OU would have the first option to turn down or accept the title (not that it's even an option), since they were the ones beaten in the title game by the cheating USC team. At the time the games were played, OU was #2, so they would be the logical choice to be #1. That goes for the BCS.
I would thing Auburn would be the logical AP champ, since that final poll is post-bowls.
OU couldn't tie Auburns shoes. Let me see, how many years has it been since an SEC team lost to a OU or Texas? OU has one thing going for it - thats a political machine managed by Bob Ostoops.
Utah gave up 21 points a game because they usually had the other team so deep in the hole by halftime that the second and third string finished the games. Utah's average margin of victory was more than a 3 TD spread.
i am a oklahoma sooner fan and hate to say it but usc would of beat the crap out of auburn,utah and all other teams so they shouldnt strip the title just for one player usc won it fair and square
The question is, what would SC have done without Reggie Bush? You have no way of knowing, just as you have no way of knowing that USC would have done anything against Auburn or Utah. That's why they actually play the games.
with out reggie bush the would still beat auburn or utah
Matt woods...
Just because Big Game Bob is now known for losing the "big game", doesn't mean USC would have beaten Auburn or OU. Don't forget that the 2005 USC was considered to be maybe the greatest college team of all time....all the way up to the point where they lost to Texas. Also, note above the scores of some of USC's other games that year. They were great, but beating 4-7 Stanford 31-28 shows they were not remotely unbeatable.
Gotta go with Matt here, USC still destroys Auburn or Utah without Bush. Thus, just leave the title vacant, NO ONE won it on the field so don't give it to some one on a guess. The title game was played, USC won, if it is vacated, so be it, but giving it to the loser of the game or a team that did not even play in the championship game is stupid.
Auburn, is the best team ever I love them Alabama sucks nuts and just got lucky this year.
Just because SC kicked the crap outta OU doesn't mean they would have done that to Auburn or UTAH. One thing has nothing to do with the other two.
Just because SC kicked the crap outta OU doesn't mean they would have done that to UTAH or Auburn. The UTES killed everyone they played that year. No one got within two TDs of them all year. Eleven players from that team went to the NFL, nine are still in the NFL. Don't just assume anything. SC would have had to win it on the field. Oh, and btw, the UTES don't buy players. UTAH runs a clean program.
Just because SC kicked the crap outta OU doesn't mean they would have done that to UTAH or Auburn. Nobody came within two TDs of the UTES that year and 11 of the players on that team went to the NFL. Nine of them are still in the league.
Oh, incidentally, the UTES don't buy players. UTAH runs a clean program.
No they don't.
2004 utah team no but i think the 2008 utah team was the best in the 2008 and got robbed from the title 2004 utah beating pitt was no where close of the 2008 utah beating alabama but usc would of destroyed auburn or utah that year in 2004
I attended every single Utah game (home and away) in both 2004 and 2008 and although the 2008 team was special and provided a much more enjoyable season full of exciting finishes and big wins, there is no doubt in my mind that the 2004 Utah team was the best team that has ever played at Utah.
The 2004 offense was unstoppable and the only reason why the Defense gave up "a lot" of points was because Utah would be up so much the 2nd and 3rd string defense would come in to get experience and give up points.
It's a shame the 2004 Utah team didn't get a chance to play USC, Auburn, or OU that year. I'm not going to proclaim we would have won, because that's flat out naive to claim so, but I'm pretty it would have been a helluva game.
No one thought 2008 Utah had a prayer against Alabama. So who's to say the 2004 Utah team would not have beaten Auburn, USC, or OU. Utah may not have a fancy national championship banner, but they have two very historic seasons in the prime of my life time and for that I am grateful and will always consider 2004 Utah and 2008 Utah champions!
the 2004 utah team had a weak schedule so ithink they couldnt hang with usc or oklahoma or auburn
Shouldn't someone be going to jail? Or shouldn't someone lose their Heisman? When is the BCS going to completely fall apart.
Utah deserves it more than anyone. Never a game in doubt all year. Killed Pitt in the Fiesta Bowl. The 11 players that went on to play in the NFL. Oklahoma was horribly exposed as overrated, and need I remind you, Auburn, while they may have an argument, also had quite a bit of cheating going on that year. Makes no sense to take it from USC who cheated, and then give it to a team that cheated.
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/columns/story?columnist=schlabach_mark&id=2532806
Utah had a great team that year, but saying they deserve it because no game was in doubt is not really relevant given the competition. Auburn beat La-Monroe, Mississippit State, La Tech, and Kentucky by an average of 42-7. That's about the schedule strength of Utah's opponents that year. Utah didn't have to play @ #8 Tennessee or against #5 LSU, etc.
Don't get me wrong, they were great. But the best team they played that year was probably the 8-3, #19 Pitt team they beat in the bowl game. As good as they were, their schedule never game them much of an opportunity to actually prove much on the field.
Also, what cheating are you talking about going on at Auburn? Did you just make that up, or is it a "everyone is doing it" comment?
Probably referring to the history of auburn football and NCAA
Hate SC all you want, but at least look at the situation objectively if you have a brain in your head. An agent hooking up Bush's greedy parents with a house his junior year--if this happened--does not help out USC. Think about it. Once again if it happened, agent hooks up parents so that kid leaves USC after the season. How in the hell does this help USC. Now if a booster, agent, coach, whatever, goes to Bush at Helix high school and says I have a gift for you or your parents if you come to this school, then you have an argument.
One more thing for all of the intellectuals on this board. Lets say it was your school and without your schools knowledge somebody hooked up one of your player's families. Is this the school's fault? If your answer is yes, then explain to me how your school is supposed to police the families--many of whom do not live anywhere near the school or live out of state--of 85 scholarship players.
I don't argue with this....the team was the team. His parents house didn't make him run faster. That's the main reason, as an Auburn fan, I wouldn't want the title anyway.
I'd take one from 1983 when we were robbed by Miami. But 2004 just didn't work out (much like 11-0 in 1993). It is a bitter pill as an Auburn fan to see 1983, 1993, and 2004 go by with no titles. That could have easily been three titles in the last three decades. Oh well.
Thanks Levity...note #2, Bush's family received these alleged benefits during his junior year. His junior year was 2005. Sorry to burst the bubbles of all you haters, but that's AFTER the 2004 championship. This stupid story is such a waste of time...