The real issue with the full body scans for frequent fliers (pilots, crews, business people) is that the radiation while being a low dose is cummulative - it ADDS UP.

There are studies to the effects of radiation over pro-longed periods. But the government won't take responsibility for that or issue folks a blank check for health issue that may arise from 10 - 20 - 30 years of continual scanning.

You will see me at the airport getting patted everytime. Happy patting all...

Couldn't agree with you more Calidude! Right on.

I'm going to make sure I have a hard-on for my pat-down. That way we'll both be uncomfortable.

I refuse to accept ANY of the given choices in your POLL because they are equally unacceptable! There ARE alternatives!

Look at Israel's security program. They are a prime target, yet no problems. They must be doing something right! And they don't sexually molest the travelers either!!!

I'll just say this and let you ponder it....

"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

Ben Franklin

People need to stop falling for this 'fear' of the bogeyman...Face it, life is scary and there are bad people out there, but that shouldn't stop anyone from living...

This is about more than a scan. It is about our freedoms being systematically being destroyed by the Presidency. Both Bush and Obama. If we continue this we will be unarmed subjects at the mercy of our government begging for food. And we have all seen what lifestyle Obama thinks he is entitled to at the expense of the American people.

YELD - if it were not for the US support of Israel we wouldn't be in the situation we are in. Don' t blame Arabs as a whole. You do realize that Arab people are of all different persuasions and religions? You do realize that if it were not for Arab culture many of the sciences would not be possible?

Wow...what would you all do if they did not have the security measures in place and YOU were on a plane that had a bomb on it and there were not more "invasive" scans? You would sue somebody if you survived, and if you didn't your family would! I see double talk!!! Imagine your wife, husband, child, mother, father...who ever that got on a plane and had a standard scan even though there were current problems flying...we have rights, but if it will benefit any other american...I am all for it!! Don't get me wrong there can be issues with the manual scans, but you have to speak up at the time of the scan!! For females, yes they will check under your boobs, it only becomes an issue if the start "fondling" them....for males...yes your going to have to go through what the females do..on a different level...but oh dang...some think if you touch them it is fondling...NOT!! Wake up america!! Terrorism is all around us. what r u willing to give up?? A little necessary handling or your life???

Killing is NOT wrong, it is natural. no one is trying to tell anyone NOT to kill... the issue is WHO to kill and who does the killing... get your rhetoric straight!

This is all completely stupid. The cartoons show pics of guys as if they are looking at the full body scans of women. From what I understand, women look at the scans of women and men look at the scans of men. If that is the case, what's the big deal? I remember gym class in jr. high - lots of naked guys running around - PE teachers supervising everything. What's the difference?

The only difference I see is that I am surrounded by a bunch of whiners that don't seem to understand that there are millions of people out there, around the world, that want you DEAD! Yet you want to whine about some low resolution picture that doesn't have your name on it being looked at by somebody of your same sex that sees hundreds or thousands of the same type of pic everyday. They can see a lot better for free on the internet. Yet you want to make a stink and put everybody at risk.

I live in a world surrounded by idiots. That is what I take from all of the this. The problem isn't the TSA. The problem is YOU!

Going thru security screening at an airport is not a big deal, other countries have been doing this for years. I would rather have my wife, children, parents be safe while flying. Invasion of privacy, thats a joke. pilots complaining about being screened, I've got news for you, you are equal and the same as everyone else, not only having the terrorist threat, but we also have to concern ourselves with sick americans. Who did the bombing in oklahoma city? A Gulf War Veteran, can you imagine just because he is a veteran that he should be exempt from screening! Hello, wake up americans! People snap, people are sick, we have priests that have been convicted of molesting kids. the list goes on. A disturbed person, whether american or terrorist may even place an explosive on thier own child or elderly parent. But why would the TSA need to ensure the elderly or children are screened, get real, most americans are living in a protected bubble, they think stuff like this can not happen. A sick person or terrorist is not going to announce themselves. And tell me! What does a terrorist look like?? If a Pilot does not want to be screened, I do not want him flying the plane that my children are on. I think they should give them a standard alcohol test before flying, I've smelled too much alcohol on pilots. Wake up people, quit your whining, or take the Bus, if you don't want to be screened, do me a favor and stay off my families flight.

Amanda #1.9

Sorry - the Great Scientific advances from the Middle East were made BEFORE Islam - mostly by the Egyptians and the Persians. Arabs contributed very little if anything to the advances, and Islam contributed absolutely NOTHING except death and decline.

YELDARB27, very clever. That was worth a few yuks.

Navy7554, Its sheeple like you that are the problem with the world, the same sheeple that supported the Nazis, the Soviets, the Khmer Rouge, and every other dictatorial regime ever to seize control.

You are the essence of what we are fighting in Afghanistan. The people of Afghanistan welcomed the Taliban with open arms because the Taliban could provide stability and safety. They welcomed this at the cost of their civil rights, look at the consequences.

To say that forcing pilots to go through this invasion of privacy daily, in order to provide for their families is not only ignorant, its stupid. A commercial pilot can drive onto the airfield and walk right up to the aircraft. A commercial pilot can go places that TSA agents aren't authorized to go. And I hate to break it to you, but a pilot doesn't need a bomb to down the aircraft, just a flick of the wrist buddy, or more likely, a momentary lapse of judgement, WAKE UP MAN!

If your that scared of terrorists you shouldn't leave your house! More aircraft are downed by pilot error than any thing else, does that stop you from flying?

This is sensationalism at best, and the result of a government that needs to manufacture fear in order to distract people from the real problems, and maintain its slipping grip of control in the face of an impotent dollar and lack of any real economic improvement.

Take a lesson from our fore fathers you spineless excuse for an American! And the same goes to all of you, for if your that willing to exchange you rights that so many have fought and died for, to appease your fears, you don't deserve to be an American!

This is not about a scan, it is about principle. Being secure in your person, free from search and seize and the right to privacy. This has been done before where people were checked upon entering and exiting the country's boarders. Stopped for inspection and search ( traffic stop wants to search car without warrant). It started in 1930's NAZI Germany. Then came the nation wide confiscation of fire arms and then the purging of undesirables from the gene pool.

Whether you admit it to yourselves or not you that will stand for this are just like the sheep in NAZI Germany who thought they could hide and wait for it to blow over. 6 million people paid for that mistake. What will it cost the US in lives so you few can be pc, or feel good about being afraid to stand. How many lives to pay for you fools that have no conception of the liberties that you so willingly abandoned.

How many lives will it cost by surrendering our basic constitutional rights. It starts with 1 then another and finally they are all gone.

I am genuinely afraid that I'll haul off and belt whoever thinks they have a right to feel me up - and I will be arrested.

I'm DOUBLY OFFENDED when there's the explanation that I'll be molested by a member of the same sex! Who decided for me that I'll be "more comfortable" being assaulted by a female than by a male? An assault is an assault no matter the sex of the perpetrator.

Here's a point for discussion: What about the rights of GAY FLIERS? Perhaps a gay woman is more offended to be felt up by a woman than by a man and vice-versa?

This is a legitimate issue and if somone decided same sex assaults are preferable to opposite sex assaults, they've made a big mistake by assuming there'a no such thing as a gay individual. Because of this assumption, gay fliers are subjected to more "painful" assaults than straight fliers. This "oversight" indicates the lack of attention to the emotional aspect of these searches.

It's assumed same sex assaults are preferable to opposite sex assaults. What is this premise based on?

NO WAY will I subject myself to such an invasion of privacy. WHY are so many other individuals so compliant when their rights and their bodies are violated?

Well said, that is one of many concerns about our invasive government and our cowardly citizens.

The simple solution is then to not fly , I do not see this a a violation of rights issue as no one is forcing you to get on the plane, There are alternative transportation methods. If you were walking down the street and were required to go thru a scanner then this would be a rights issue, However no one is forcing anyone to go to the airport and get on a plane, If you are doing it for your job or vacation then you are doing it voluntarily. If you are so afraid of going thru the scanner for health issues then get the pat down, If that bothers you then just do not fly.

The passengers aboard the plane who have chosen to fly have more of a right to be secure from the danger of a weapon or explosive than does a passenger who refuses the scan or pat down for privacy reasons.

I second this comment.

There is absolutely no way to prevent determined terrorists from eventually circumventing any prevention method. Suicide bombers, kamikaze pilots, or anyone else that is willing to give their life, are extremely hard to prevent. While you may catch some, or even most, one will eventually find a way to get through any security.

What we have going on here is a decimation of our rights and privacy,all in the name of preventive security. I guarantee you that the airlines are more worried about losing planes and profits, than they are about the passengers.

I have had the advantage to have boarded a plane when there was no security needed. Then there was the questions they had to ask, and then there came the metal detectors. Now they have to search my privates just to make sure that my underwear isn't explosive, or that there isn't a stick of dynamite in my pants, and I am just happy to see them. What will come next, a full body cavity exam?

I know that I would be offended if someone that I was not intimate with, or at least a doctor, was to be able to touch my privates. I would be especially outraged if they were to search my 13 year old daughter. Only if I am arrested should I have to go through that procedure. They say that they will not search any children under 12, but how can we be sure that the terrorists won't start using children to smuggle weapons and bombs. They certainly don't have much of a problem with that in the middle east, do they?

What it boils down to is that there is absolutely no way to prevent these terrorists, no matter how much security you put in place. All you end up doing is stripping the innocent of their constitutional rights.

Some may ask, "But how do we prevent them then?". Unfortunately that answer may be as bad as the problem. While we can't drop an A-bomb on all of them, we may have to do something just about as drastic to get this to stop.

What we can't do is strip our citizens of their rights in order to protect them from something that can't be fully prevented. While a certain amount of security should be allowed, what they are doing now is too far.

I would much rather drive than fly anymore. Who knows, street, road, and highway checkpoints may be next too. I am sure that the terrorists are looking at that option too. Soon we may be hearing the old familiar words......."PAPERS PLEASE" just to go to the store.

Just how far are we willing to let our government strip our rights, to protect us?

Don Draper....LMAO....that is great!

People in this Country seem to get confused about the rights of our freedom. You do NOT have a "right" to fly in an airplane any way you see fit. It is a convenience and a privalage. You may not like how they do it, but it is not your "right".

To those of you who are comparing being "patted down" to being molested: Shame on you! You should be embarrassed! I personally think you owe children who have been molested an apology!

If you are being "patted down" that is YOUR CHOICE. Just walk into the dedgum machine! You sound like idiots!

We do have rights in this Country, but there are somethings that are not rights, they are privalages and conveniences.

yep...flying is not a constitutional right you morons. Stay off the planes, more room for folks with some common sense.

Robb04 and TLTEXAS - my feeling exactly. Invasion of privacy?? It is not a God given right to fly on a plane. If you don't want a scan or pattdown, don't fly. I want the plane to be as secure as possible for me and my family.

floyd - enjoy your drive!

"It's all about security," Napolitano said. "It's all about everybody recognizing their role."

The second sentence says it all because she is saying "know your place peasant and stay under our thumb".

I'm all for the pat downs. It'd be the most action I've had in a while.

Low dose? One body scan equals 20 chest x-rays...without the lead vest. I'm am totally stunned by everyone's eagerness to contract cancer before they will submit to a standard pat down. Get over yourselves.

And to think National Public Radio summarily fired and then publicly insulted Juan Williams for honestly commenting that he "felt nervous" seeing Muslims in airports.

Look at what our airports have become...and they haven't become this way because of Swedes and Italians.

Now there are reports coming out that Muslim women are seeking a 'religious' exemption from being searched or scanned below the neck.

I hope they get that exemption and can no longer be searched...like an American grandmother or three year child can be searched. It would be a perfect commentary on what this country has become.

So this make perfect sense... We dont profile the people who are more likely to commit these act of terrorism and CAIR is working to allow the same people (that we are taking these dramitic steps to Stop) to bypass this type of security do to thier religion and laws. Lates information AARP members were not threating to 9-11 look like a fire cracker compared to what they have instore next.

If we don't stop being a touchy feely (no pun intended) nation we will loose every time and if CAIR can get fully veiled woomen and muslim men do to thier religion and relious law then why let them come to the US? We are suppose to be a menlting pot... Right, So if one does not abide by our laws because to muslim their religion is law then why move here?

and if we are not allowed to check those who have tryied to bring down planes after 9-11, THEN WHAT IS THE FREAKIN POINT?

Think I'll strip befor they pat me down. hehehe. Goan with satisfaction then go try to smoke somewhere . . . .

Thanks Jimmy, I will enjoy my drive......for now. I am all for some level of security at our airports, but treating everyone like a criminal before they commit a crime is a crime in itself.

The 4th Amendment states: The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

It specifically states that a person has "the right to be secure in their persons..........against unreasonable searches". Unless there is evidence that you have or might commit a crime, then these extremely close patdowns can be construed as unreasonable.

Also, the viewing of our bodies as if we didn't have clothes on is also unreasonable unless there is evidence of a crime. Just boarding a plane is not evidence of a crime.

Just how far is everyone going to let the government go to prevent the unpreventable? We are at war is a religion, not a country, or a specific race of people. There is no absolute way of keeping a potential terrorist off of all of our planes. I am not saying that we should give up on all security, but we have to, at some point, say enough is enough. Otherwise, you are letting the terrorist win.

Hey all you Terrorism and Security experts,

The constitution doesn't protect your right to fly. They really should have two flights to every city; one will be of all fully screened passengers, and the other flight, passengers can just get on the plane and not worry about their "4th amendment rights being violated". I have had the new screening, and nobody gropes you. So they slid their hand to the crease of my leg, BIG DEAL. I would rather make sure no one on my plane has anything hidden there. No one is grabbing anyone's "junk" like some people have reported. When you want to fly, you know you will have to submit yourself to screening, you know what that consists of.....so if you are to shy, drive.

To many people believe what they see on the news, or read in the media without looking into what is really going on. If you look at the TSA.gov website, you can see what the images show on the body scanners....its virtually nothing. Glad you people don't live in Isreal, I have seen people writting that their airport security is not as invasive as ours....these people have no idea what they are talking about......they don't care about your feelings there, they do whatever they need to to keep their planes safe.

Ok, here is a scenario for everyone. Since we are now doing body scans and or pat downs, the terrorist decided to ingest the explosive deivces, or stick them up their bums. They end up being successful at blowing up a plane.

Are you going to consent to having your rectum checked to get on a plane, since the terrorists can hide something there?????????

Scenario 2: The terrorist find a way to implant explosives into children or babies.

Are you going to have your children go through a cavity search just so you can prevent that from happening too????????

At what point are you going to say enough is enough???? How much radiation and physical groping, or cavity searches, will you endure for the sake of preventing the unpreventable?????

The poll question leaves out the most obvious choice - profiling. That way only the bad guys are inconvenienced. But sadly, PC rules the day so...Spread 'em, Granny!

I tried to drive to Rueto Rico but my car kept flooding out.

Have you noticed the BLUE GLOVES that the TSA uses for the Pat Downs??? And have you noticed that THEY DO NOT CHANGE THE GLOVES after frisking the previous passenger, who just might have some germs bad for you???? All other professionals change gloves along with the proper sanitary disposal after finishing working with each individual. So why should TSA be required to apply any less than acceptable standard health practices??? The gloves are for protecting themselves and they could care less about their passengers' health. Start demanding better health standards of practice requirements from the TSA when conducting their frisking, especially with young children and the elderly whose immune systems may not be as strong. Also, notify the Health Dept. concerning the TSA not changing gloves along with the lack of proper disposal of unsanitary gloves after frisking each individual.

HEALTH ALERT: HEALTH ISSUES TO ASK HOMELAND SECURITY, HEALTH DEPT., & TSA:

Have you noticed the BLUE GLOVES that the TSA uses for the Pat Downs??? And have you noticed that THEY DO NOT CHANGE THE GLOVES after frisking the previous passenger, who just might have some germs bad for you???? IT IS VERY EASY TO SPREAD INFECTIONS SUCH AS CHLAMYDIA AND TRICHOMONIASIS , etc.

HEALTH ALERT: HEALTH ISSUES TO ASK HOMELAND SECURITY, HEALTH DEPT., & TSA:

Have you noticed the BLUE GLOVES that the TSA uses for the Pat Downs??? And have you noticed that THEY DO NOT CHANGE THE GLOVES after frisking the previous passenger, who just might have some germs bad for you???? IT IS VERY EASY TO SPREAD INFECTIONS SUCH AS: CHLAMYDIA AND TRICHOMONIASIS , etc.

Just Imagine the agner of some poor Soldier who has PTSD and since CAIR Supported by big SIS allows Muslim Men and Women not to be touched just wanded and let through. imagine how that Soldier is going to feel.

who says that anyone is just wanded through because they are Muslim. I have Muslim friends who get strip searched almost every time they try to fly. I would like to know where you got this info screamingEagle?

Also my husband is a veteran, and my nephew is an Iraq, Afghanistan vet who was wounded. He is now a counselor for vets with PTSD. He isn't anti Muslim so what difference does the religion make?

Not all of us comback with it. I didnt start showing signs untill after my 6th tour. I am Happy your Nephew is making a good life.

Do a Search for Muslims (CAIR) exempt from TSA screanings. Read It 16 NOV.

My point after a long freek'in night was that you have many soldiers who have been fighting the very group that is trying to kill us in the field everyday and plotting attacks worldwide not to mention back home.

We see the tricks played by our foes, They will dress up like women or they convince a female to thier bidding as redemption for thier family or a lost sibling who thought it would be a great idea to attack a Co. post in mountains or who ran out in the street of Baghdad to retrieve his buddies RPG or wepon and was shot.

So a Person see's these aggressive pat downs and then see a women in a Hijab only reciveing the minimal screaning. Look at CAIR's website...

Instead of a Pat-Down you can always request to pat your own scarf, including head and neck areas and have the officer perform a chemical swap/swipe in your hands.

I am just pointing out that the people who want us dead are not having to go through the same process and while i'm on a plane for some reason after ...Oh...9 years of active combat and firefight after firefight my attention in the cabin of the Aircraft is not going to be on the little old married coupple from the villiages nor will it be on the little Johnny kicking the back of my seat. It will be focused on what I have been focusing on for the last 9 years. That is just how one's mind operates after a awhile.

my nephew in Hawaii , now being sent to Guam, spent many years on notification duty after he was wounded. That lead to a total breakdown, but he is trying to stay in so he can retire with 20. they are trying hard to get him out. We will see.

We are not fighting Muslims, we are supposed to be fighting terrorists. So the religion of the people flying on planes shouldn't be considered. CAIR may well want them not to search women in Hijab, but that is true of many groups, not just Muslims. I know for a fact many Muslims who get strip searched every time they fly.

If you need help readjusting to civilian life I would suggest you lobby the Republicans to put more money into helping Vets and the VA, as they keep wanting to cut it all out. Just because we fought that Japenese and Germans in WWII didn't give our fathers and uncles the right to freak on all German and Japanese Americans, many of who fought with extreme valor. (Japanese men were decorated fighters as were German Americans, we treated the German and Japanese American Families badly, lets not make the same mistake again--Muslims are NOT the enemy, terrorists are.

Why adjust? I am not in the US right now! I may need help upon my return for good. But I am staying alive and keeping my troopers alive. Of course we are not fighting all Muslims. But the war in Afghanistan and the War we fought in Iraq was fought against those whom have a failed understanding of Islam and who are MUSLIM.

I also get great Treatment from TSA as I am In Uniform and an easy mark. So when I travel and I see Folks not being examed as thoroughly as I am it kind of gets on my nerves. And as they touched i.e. search my wife who is 7 months pregnant (as I would a captured combatant) is not neccesary! She would not go through the X-ray machine as the harms it could inflict to our child is unknown.

The entire TSA objective is clouded by political PC and politisans that are afraid to stand up and Identify or target individuals based on intelligence gathered by local, state and federal agencies. These pat down are a waiste of time and cause undo stress upon people just moving from here to their and pose no threat. The Enemy again will adapt to these techniques and it is proven that a man will ing to give his life for a cause will most likly succeed. However to this date I can recal no 80 year old man nor a chatholic priest trying to detonate an explossive on board a US aircraft in recent years.

Did they shove their hands up your butt crack and high up into your crotch? The agent that did my pat down 2 days ago was not gentle at all.

Amanda, lighten up. Just a little humor and remember when OUR plane is on its way down or towards a building, and it is NOT a person of Arab/Muslim descent doing it....I will be the first one to apologize to you for me being so racially insensitive...if I can get to you before we both hit the ground/target. Until then..it is Arabs 100%; Others 0%. Just bad luck for you folks I guess. Nothing anyone else should be aware of or suspicious about either, right???.

arab nor muslim are a race. They are a nationality, there are only 4 races.

Well, that just makes it all better now, doesn't it?

just makes it more accurate so some liberal does not come by and use it for ammo to slam you

my opinion: the pat downs and the scans would be all very well if they weren't going to be afraid to apply the same requirements to Muslims and other religious groups just as they are now. I got harassed a few years ago at Spokane International Airport because the 8th grade drop out TSA person didn't know the difference between a 2 oz (allowed) and larger (not allowed) sealed bottle of contact lens cleaner. I was traveling to a place where I would have no transportation, no way to get to a store to buy more, and contacts in my eyes that would need removing by end of day. I asked her to give it back, she called her manager, her manager did not know how to speak politely to anyone, and in short the police became involved before I got my solution back, the guttersnipe manager's name (which resulted in her being demoted, and hopefully ultimately fired)---but even more significant is the fact that another gentleman who flew every Monday when I did waited for me on the other side (we do not know each other but always chatted) and noted that should I need his confirmation he would be my witness as to what had happened. He also pointed out that, being black, wearing a beard, and a small crocheted Muslim-style cap, guaranteed he would never be searched and never had been. In fact, he then showed me an open 4 oz bottle of Aqua Velva sitting right in his carry-on--never mentioned. He found that a bit offensive on my behalf, stating that reverse profiling is harassment without cause. He was a very intelligent man.

None...

A few years ago a male security agent visited my 'junk' area for a second time. I told him to either let me pass or I wanted to see his supervisor so I could ask why two such visits were needed.

He let me pass immediately.

Today...I would probably be detained or arrested.

If I was a molester...I'd be applying for TSA jobs all over the country....describing myself as a self-starter who is eager to get to work !

To those that say flying is not a right but a priviledge- Don't they say that about driving a car. What is to stop this nonsense to random searches on the highway where you get stopped and patted.

We know the government walks over our rights and is always telling us it is a priviledge to fly, drive, walk.....

IT NEEDS TO STOP SOMEWHERE. All you sheep who see nothing wrong with this are the problem.

When did the public lose its spine?

So if we submit then the government is guaranteeing our SAFETY?

BS!

the metal detector is ok. maybe sniffer dogs at the check in. sniffer dogs for the luggage. the you take your chances. No radioactive scans, or invasive pat downs.

You are losing them now a hell of alot faster than you think. each time just a little less rope till you don't realize you don't have any left and are falling

Nobody has lost or violated your rights, you have the choice to fly, if you do fly, you will be screened, your choice. If you drive, you will need a drivers liscense, or you will go to jail if caught. Rules and Regulations pal, follow them or if you wish, don't follow them.

Nobody wants to look at your flab.

Many complain until another unthinkable event happens. Then many will complain again that the TSA has not done enough. The TSA can't win!

I've got news for you! What the TSA is doing is still not enough!

Stop crying or stop flying!

1st I am not your pal, 2ed if you were in the navy I would think you cared more about your constitutional rights. To be free from illegal search and seizure, to be secure in your person. You say no one is taking my rights, they are everyday. Who the hell do you think is taking them away, it is our very own government.

Put your head in the sand if you do not have the guts to stand up against the injustices that are happening everyday to our freedoms.

This is why we will be taken over with little resistance, you in favor of that.. Sport

There is certainly no right to fly. There is also no reasonable need for anyone TO fly. If saving a couple dozen hours is worth the loss of dignity and privacy to some, that is fine, and their choice. I have stopped flying as a result of this trend, a couple years ago in fact. My refusal has also pulled the plug on at least one fairly frequent flyer.

What is disturbing though, are the pro-screening folks; they seem quite angry that a growing number of people have said, "that's too far."

Could it be they've realized that air travel is only affordable to them when the majority of Americans remain willing and content to fly?

Just say "no" to air travel.

Besides, with "get there 3 hours before flight.. and "where did they put my luggage this time.." exactly how much time do most people really save anyway?

This whole issue sounds to me like a great opportunity for the government to start looking to get people interested in a massive dose of "high speed rail".

And we'll spend bushels of billions putting that money-losing enterprise into service.

And folks won't have to be scanned or groped...until the first train blows up.

I would like to see a log of how many terrorists our enhanced security measures have actually stopped?????

Lets take it back to December 2001. I would be willing to be that the TSA has not caught one terrorist!

How come we don't hear about any successes only the "possible threats"?

Someone please publish the TSA findings as I think they are batting 0%.

I think the TSA at least owes the public a peek at their stunning track record.

Oh please. Your ridiculous. How about the right to not be blown up in the air? President Obama doesn't have anything to do with the enhanced security screenings.

There are some people who rob banks. Should we pat down and scan everyone who walks into a bank? There are people who rob convenience stores, should we scan, pat down, and strip search everyone who walks into 7 eleven? There are a few people who steal cars, should we set up Imperial checkpoints to match the driver with the registration? (no more loaning your car out to a friend or relative) There are a tiny handful of people who blow up airplanes, and that justifies TSA? Let's face it, the terrorists have won; our freedom is gone. Most of the bomb-scare stories we hear are over-hyped and trumpeted to "justify" the TSA and Homeland Security's efforts to kill the airline industry, because real attacks are so few and far between. But, again, it no longer matters because our freedom is already gone. How much more are we all going to take?

"How about the right to not be blown up in the air?" - Life is dangerous. In the end, life kills you. What makes life worth living is the freedom you have before it kills you. A life without freedom is not a life worth living. The government can keep its grubby hands to itself and I will accept that life may end at any time. Living safe is for animals in zoos. I choose the jungle with all the joys and dangers it holds.

wall of J. youer right however the government is trying to pervent another 9-11 from happening

"take back USA" - People like you make me hope to see the United States break up. I don't want to share my national identity with a hater like you. I suggest you start a secession movement in your state and secede.

lets have the 1st lady and her kids privated touched on camera then we will follow suit. lol not we as i live in canada and dont allow this @!$%# here and i wont fly or travel the 35 minutes to the usa as long as they are takeing away your/our rights more and more every day. enough is enough dont fly for a month and see how things change as the airlines will be asking for more money?

Obama has nothing to do with what kind of fruit cake are you...... maybe if you come out from under that rock your under and discover what is going on in the real world, you might see the light. One day you may know how to save you and maybe any family you might have. Don't wait for Obama to save you he will be off the nearest hide out camp to save his and his alone you are his garbage and that is all your worth to him..

Stephen, not a hater. Just a realist. Check the history of Islam and read the Koran. They meet the definition of a hate group yet we want to afford them the same rights as we have. If you want to see the USA break up, then you are the enemy of our great nation and like my Dad, I will fight all forces that want to take that away. You are a not an American if that is how you feel.

This is not partisan politics. But it is all smoke and mirrors with a dog and pony show as a bonus. We are not safer than before, just more gullible and sheeplike, ie easier to control.

This is about post 911-not Obama. Do you think if we have a different president, we will go back to allowing box cutters on planes?

You are not an American if that is how you feel.

What a moronic comment.

Tina, Do you want to overthrow our country to?

Moot point Wall of J, you are comparing a few lives and thousands of dollars worth of damage (gas station/bank), to hundreds of lives and millions worth of damage (jet plane). No life is worth more than the next but common sense explains why there is TSA at Airports vs Gas stations. Again moot point.

Do you want to overthrow our country to (sic)?

Overthrow it to what?

Oh please. Your ridiculous. How about the right to not be blown up in the air? President Obama doesn't have anything to do with the enhanced security screenings.

Actually, Mike, he does have something to do with the enhanced screenings. The TSA is under the control of DHS. The head of DHS is Homeland Security Secretary Napolitano. Napolitano was appointed by the notorious Obama. If he didn't like the way she was doing things, he'd replace her. Easy as that. So, at the very least, he approves of the new screening measures.

Moot point Wall of J, you are comparing a few lives and thousands of dollars worth of damage (gas station/bank), to hundreds of lives and millions worth of damage (jet plane). No life is worth more than the next but common sense explains why there is TSA at Airports vs Gas stations. Again moot point.

You're completely missing the point. If you want higher numbers, let's try scannings and random fondlings at all the schools, since there have been a couple of school shootings. Oh wait, that's already done in city schools (not some of the suburban or rural districts, even though that's where most of the shootings have been reported).

The point is, the government and the media are trumpeting (and, in many cases, exaggerating or outright lying about) singular instances in order to manufacture fear. By manufacturing fear in the people, they manufacture the people's consent for whatever draconian measures they choose to take. Why are so many of you so thoroughly convinced that the US can't possibly become a Nazi-style dictatorship? Name one thing that would prevent that. Don't you get it yet? It's happening now!

" So, at the very least, he approves of the new screening measures."

The sob probable could care less about it because he will never have to go thru the screenings.

Old Bushy Boy started the pat down, not Obama. Not that I admire either of them.

The Airline Security should require Saran Wrap, clear stretch plastic to do "manual pat downs".

In my statement, I meant to say the Pat down is the way to go. No one needs to be exposed to more "radiation"; potentially a combination for getting cancer. The less, the better.

This will really turn the questionable flyers to no flyers at all. It is too much of a hassle to even fly on a 1 or 2 hour flight. Drive your car. Have a pleasant experience.

Meanwhile all the Terrorists of late, have been citizens of the US, not flying but planting bombs in soft targets.

Both methods will again slow down the flying experience at the airport. More delays.

Aloha! Hawaii, we need to get more passenger trains going and the bus lines are catching on with executive type buses, with bars, food service and more. Screw the airlines, Ive seen some very attractive pricing from AmTrak and that may be the way to go. The railroad industry could make a killing if they resurrect the old passenger train service. China is outdistancing the US on train travel with their new super train

Hold that thought!:

Absolutely great ideas!!!--I used to fly mega lots---am now disappointed with all the delays, the 3 ounce bottles, separating meds; the general hassle of getting to the airport 3 hours before flight schedule.

HOLD---just look at the per centage of people who will not fly? on this questionaire---It is shocking. This will "kill" the flight experience even more.

Charging for this and that, long, slow lines, kids crying, putting them at an inconvience, then getting some stupid Security guard, pulling me over for the "wand" experience. Had it happen. Yes, I do look like a Terrorist. They pick out people who may fit into a number system. Old Grannies in Wheel Chairs, the infirmed, but political correctness, says, "don't pull over the women or men who might be of another faith"---it is insulting to them..

Yes, the crippled, infirmed, Moms are the Terrorists. How do so many Extreme Terrorists get on these flights now? Sure some are not reported to the public, because it will panic us. AmTrak and other ways of transportation are going to see an upswing in passengers.

The whole Security Check System is not perfect; nor will it ever be. It's a chance of luck while flying.

My daughter almost always seems to get the scan or the search. She's the least threatening looking person you'd ever want to see. I have no idea why they would pick her. She's not crippled, infirmed, or a mom, either.

seen too much:

I think they go by numbers, like if you are #7 person or #20 going through Security. This is a good question.

hey take back USA just wanted to say that your kind make me ashamed to say that i'm an American.

I live in California. I ain't drivin' to Florida! And I can't drive to Hawaii. So planes it is. And if they want to scan me or fondle me or whatever - no problem! Just get me there safely.

To all the complainers: they probably don't want to look at your overweight junk anyhow - get over yourselves. There is much better to see for free on the internet. And they don't want to feel you up, either. They are just doing their jobs and trying to keep everyone as safe as possible.

Get over it.

Moot point Hold that thought, you are comparing a few lives and thousands of dollars worth of damage (employers), to hundreds of lives and millions worth of damage (jet plane). No life is worth more than the next but common sense explains why there is TSA at Airports vs Gas stations. Again moot point.

lowrent:

apparently you are either too close to, or too far away from, the sort of lowlife person who is enthralled by a real or perceived power over other humans. We see some (NOT!!! all, mind you) police officers and correction officers with that mentality. Poorly educated, poorly paid aircraft screeners would necessarily fit into the profile as well. NOT!!! all of them. But if you read my post above (apologies for the lengthiness) you will see that many of them are not in the least interested to public safety---it's their job, they don't care, and can't or won't recognize many dangerous items that are STILL getting on our aircraft every day!! The important thing seems to be control for them. I defy anyone to place a hand on my body and I would first see what the scanner reveals before I will submit to it. IT ISN'T GOING TO DO ANY GOOD, IT IS A WASTE OF TIME AND A WASTE OF RESOURCES. I don't need to fly, I can get anywhere I need to go nearly in the same time driving versus the looooong lines through security, the added indignities of being handled by a stranger whatEVER sex, that does NOT matter---then the delays, the bumpings, the holding aircraft at the gate because they're not full yet (thank YOU Alaska Scarelines)--and I can carry a bottle of soda with me, I can sit and stop where I please, and the only way I am going to be detained and handled and scanned is if I commit a crime and am placed under arrest. and that is how it should be! WE are not the criminals. Target THEM.

Hey all you Terrorism and Security experts,

The constitution doesn't protect your right to fly. They really should have two flights to every city; one will be of all fully screened passengers, and the other flight, passengers can just get on the plane and not worry about their "4th amendment rights being violated". I have had the new screening, and nobody gropes you. So they slid their hand to the crease of my leg, BIG DEAL. I would rather make sure no one on my plane has anything hidden there. No one is grabbing anyone's "junk" like some people have reported. When you want to fly, you know you will have to submit yourself to screening, you know what that consists of.....so if you are to shy, drive.

To many people believe what they see on the news, or read in the media without looking into what is really going on. If you look at the TSA.gov website, you can see what the images show on the body scanners....its virtually nothing. Glad you people don't live in Isreal, I have seen people writting that their airport security is not as invasive as ours....these people have no idea what they are talking about......they don't care about your feelings there, they do whatever they need to to keep their planes safe.

The problem with having 2 flights, one for screened and one for un-screened is that only is allowing the people who are flying to feel better about their decision. Unfortunately, that does nothing for the people on the ground when the plane crashes into their workplace.

Nobody here complaining seems to consider the bigger picture. It's not just about those who fly it's also about those who are at risk from the plane and who may or may not be in it.

HOLD:

It won't happen. There are people who are watching over the Security people; they also have so many thousands of people to "hand touch", that like a doctor, they become all the same bodies--no thrill, no face.

This would be a good job for a pervert.--except the lines will move even more slow. Darn Security measures, they taken the fun out of entering an airliner. No wonder vacation resorts are begging for people to come to their places for the escape of life with cheap offers to stay..

priceless ill have my wife try this as she is a loud excitement female at the moment!!!!! ill let you know if this works?

Hold that thought : And where do you suppose the video tape from those searches will end up? How about YouTube, Howard Stern, the local porn shop. I'm sure there are creeps out there with a, " I like to see people get groped " fetish. If there is a supply, there is a market.

And what about children, if anyone views these imagines of children they are guilty of child pornography under the law. I do not see anywhere that they are making any changes in that law and if they do what loophole would that create for pedophiles.

open minded

the government said these scans would never be kept. However now the FBI has 130,000 in storage. In storage for what? The FBI says traing, I don't by that, the training would come with using the machine. Not even in service fully and the government is all ready lying about it.

Well put Doc.

awesome thought....very funny! thanks for the giggles.

I'm doing it.

Fine. Walk.

I'll wave from 32,000 feet and beat you by 3 weeks.

She will have honor and integrity, you will not.

why thankyou dr. evans. better to be beat by 3 weeks than to be sucker and patsy for the government such as lorent and drop your drawers.

Hence why we now have body scanners and pat downs...

It seems you are defending these sensible procedures, so this post is no attack on you.

It can't really be all that bad, can it? You have done it. No big deal, I am sure. But there are always the loons that want to stir the pot...

A friend of mine was delayed for 2 hours because she had an insulin pump and damned near missed her plane. The TSA people would not even look at her doctor's letter.

They were rude to her besides. "Sensible procedures"? I think not. I call it bullying.

minimum wage storm troopers that lost their job flipping burgers at McDonalds.

Ha! Lorent hasn't flown lately . . .

seen too much:

I'd rather have a "Pat down" with hands facing me, than go through any radiation at all. Most of us have much too radiation with x-rays, etc., or the darn CT Scan, of which is used indiscriminately in many hospitals for many conditions. Way too much radiation from the medical pros..

Homeland Security has not told us how much Radiation we will be getting. They have been secretive about this. It's better to be on the safe side, than have to worry about that.

It beats going to jail for screaming, slapping, kicking, or getting in an official's face before you realize what you are doing. PTSD is a tough thing to deal with.

in Canada they don't touch anyone without permission in the USA it seems the tsa can touch and feel anyone???? you need a prime-minister like Trudeau instead of presidents like bush and carter and .... obama doesn't seem to be doing much other than sitting on the fence???? and it will not be good for the airlines as who wants there kids and teens subjected to this bull-chit? not me no fly zone is the USA.

Tinbanger, my feelings exactly when it comes to kids. By the definition of the law anyone who views a minor without clothes is guilty of child pornography and that law is carved in stone may also be quilty of conspiring to exploit a child. These machines are capable of storing images and can be transfered to a zip drive.

WE are treading in dangerous water here folks. Don't let fear, annixety or party politics influence what you think. This is wrong at so many levels. It is worse than NAZI germany at it's peak.

Idiots all.

Please just stay out of the airports so the rest of us can go about our business as safely as possible.

Nobody is making you fly. If it is so objectionable to you the solution is simple - DON"T FLY. As if I care. More seats and better prices for me. Stay the hell away.

you are just blind, many of us will not fly, any more but that won't stop this violation against the American people. it's just the tip of the ice burg . We are becoming a Nation of slaves to the state. I guess you have to lose all your rights and freedom before you wake up.

Who are you talking to drkellam?

No caps. Iceberg is one word. And it is spelled with an "e" not a "u".

Anymore should probably be one word the way you are using it.

Honestly, your post makes you sound like a kook. It makes me wonder why your vote has as much value as mine.

Please, don't fly. Stay out of the mainstream of American culture. You are just getting in the way.

lorent

You slap that self righteous paint brush pretty wide. You have shown nothing in your post to think your vote is more valuable than any ones, you have however shown that you should not be allowed to vote at all. You think for some unknown reason you can talk down to others just because you don't agree with their position, you call us idiots and imply less intelligent. You are a troll. I would much rather be branded as an idiot with civil rights than what you are branded as, a coward with no rights but smiling as you receive for food allotment from the gov each month.

If you willingly give away even one of your rights you deserve none of them.

Seen Too Much: I'm sure you're correct regarding professionals - but TSA screeners aren't professionals - they're the same folks who worked at Micky D's last week. Being a screener is a power trip for these guys.

Well said Dr. Evans! Lorent's comments have been irritating throughout this thread.

run for president who knows ma-bee? your next?

Dear lorent, A few months ago I was new to News Vine and some of my posts had grammar and punctuation errors because I was typing too fast on a foreign keyboard. I found myself being lambasted over and over again by a self indulged, condescending pompous p r i c k such as yourself. Is your life so mundane and pathetic that you can't get past the proper use of English? Quit the bully act and try to focus on the purpose of this forum or get off, because you're taking up too much screen space with your irrelevant posts.

open minded

well said, bravo

If you want that job just make sure you have a visible swastika somewhere when turning in your application. Im sure youll be a shoe-in even if you wear a turbine to the interview.

Just one?

Just a pat down really doesn't do it as far as I'm concerned. I always insist that I be handcuffed during the pat down while being verbally abused as well. At JFK just ask for Olga and request the #3...geez, who wants just a scan?

Huntington, You sound like a sexually oppressed, inexperienced prude. You think the #3 is fun, next time get the #17 with Tabasco sauce and ask for Hans. I won't even tell you what they do with the chicken.

guito, a "turbine" might be kind of heavy to wear.

LOL

Yeh but think about it. Everyone would be so jealous if he was the only one that generate his own electricity..... I find it hard enough to get through the metal detector with a belt buckle, just imagine getting through one with a turbine!!!

I'm dying!!! This is the best thread in months. A "turbine"......

Yep, I vote for having a boner and bringing some Astroglide that will get taken away anyway.

LMAOROTF!!!

Or What about The recent controversy in which body scan images of Indian Actor and celebrity Shahrukh Khan were printed and traded among security staff at Heathrow Airport (despite claims that they can't do that)? Even if the machines don't have the ability to "store" the image, what's to stop someone from taking a picture of the screen with their cell phone and sending out to friends, etc.? I've heard that photography experts have demonstrated how easily these black and white images can be converted into a color image that resembles a real photograph.

Also, Do the security people have to go through this screening when they report to work every day? Who is watching the watchers?

tsa should be banned and all fired and hire a new boss and new rules. hire a jew like the white has many it will solve all as isreal is a #1 target but there airports are smooth? without the bull-chit that the usa puts all through for morel support???

Like they want to store a pic of your fat butt...

many of your post mention overweight people. Are you just an ass or do you have a fetish or are you just fat as hell in the real world so you tell these strangers your normal???

yeld

your an ass, you bring nothing to this discussion and your answers and actions are a pathetic attempt at humor. I would be willing to bet I am in better shape that you. The only thing you work out is your mouth (fingers). piss off sport

As long as round is still considered a shape, you will always be in shape. Bet you could type faster if you put that biscuit down.

that might have been your best post yet to bad it still sounds like a 6 yr old wrote it

indeed as a Canadian we still live that way in our igloos. but we can and do love our land and our knives. and of course we still eat beaver some fury some bald?

Ok, you got me. I'm biting. What is your first most important survival tool? Besides your brain. Does it have a barrel?

A lot of people, me included, are at that point.

As I said before, no problem! Carry a big flag while you are walking. It will be hard to see you from 6 miles up! But I'll wave if I can!

prickless wonder

So do the pat downs and quit whining.

put people in space cost billions yet the usa wont put the explosive sniffers in place hmmmmmmm? obama needs to re-think or he will sink the airlines and cripple the usa econimy even more? his choice?

I guess you aren't flying again, then. No worries - more seats for me.

Lorent: Hmmm. How many seats do you need? Thinking Dr Evans is correct, you're the fat a$$.

Too bad the Ignore this author link isn't working and I have to read, or at least notice, the nonsensical ramblings of lorent.

You've been had. This is exactly what the government wants to hear from you. They want us to be sufficiently afraid that we will give up the freedoms we said we cherished. Now look what's happened: our freedoms are gone!

1 person with any knife these days is a dead man on a plane id love to be on that plane with 3 of the so called terrorists with utility knives it would be fun to kill with no prison and be a hero 3 of them with knives against many it doesnt work that way anymore as the cant get to the captain? what can they do with there little knives???? other than die very quickly? with 1 canadian on board.

Most of you griping have probably never even been through the scanners. They are truly no big deal. So what if they see your crap it is the same as everyone elses, and these days more people see more when a women bends over because of the lack of people knowing how to dress!! Invasion of privacy...no. If a plane blew up and no one on board was checked everyone would be griping they should have been. Can't please everyone. You can take your choice of the scanner or the pat down. If you don't choose the scanner your and idiot. The only thing is they need something for children, everyone over 18 grow up!!

tinbanger - I would bet the average payload of passengers could take out ten of the idiots. I, too, would like to see them try. Basically if they do it on a flight I am on they are giving me permission to execute them with no trial.

Rest assured, that is what would happen if I am onboard. The plane lands with a lot of dead terrorists on it!

wow am I supposed to be impressed now??? you are to much of a coward to stand up for your constitutional rights being stolen but you are brave enough to attack and kill a group of terrorist on a plane?.........hummmmm..... You are a liar and a coward.

I have determined through your post there is nothing to you physically, mentally morally nor ethically. You are a troll taking up screen space to spew your cowardly propaganda to suit your hidden agenda. You simply jump around insulting people but you have not made a single post with any substance to it. Itis all blblblblblblbaaaa bulls*t

go away and let these people have a ddiscussion with out having to deal with your rhetoric. You and your post just have no worth, no substance, absolutely no redeeming value just a waste of god's air.

Good day and good night

See comment 19.1. Our freedom is gone now because of the easily frightened who kept saying safety is more important than privacy, dignity, or any other freedoms that we said we cherished. There are plenty of bank robbers out there who might shoot any witnesses; will you gladly submit to deep friskings, scannings, and confiscations every time you walk into a bank too? It will happen before long if too many people keep that same attitude.

I say we create a big comfortable camp for all of the security-wanting-cry-babies, put guards around it and a big wall, and let the pussies live securely in their little camp. The rest of us can enjoy our freedom, take risks, and live life to the fullest.

You are so right!!!

Stephen DeVoy-2540373, that is a good idea but I doubt it is workable. On the other hand we could ship them off to some Marxist country were their security will be vested in the Government, or even Cuba. My understanding is that Castro makes all the decisions and security arrangements for his "Subjects".

Stephen - LMFAO!!!

The problem is, there is NO guarantee that these measures will work. The terrorists just find another way around it. Like someone said earlier, "What's next? Cavity searches?" My grandma used to fly in the 70's. She travelled the globe, during a time when hi-jacking was the threat. She told us, "I'm not going to stop living life. If it's my time, it's my time." I follow her belief.

want I heard the TSA has and is talking about doing cavity searches if need be. I will be damned if they would ever touch me in that manner. I refuse to fly and never will as long as this stipulation is in place. I hope the airlines goes under because of this. Just goes to show the FEDS have just screwed one of the biggest corporations there is.

?

if you are addressing me at least have the courage to speak to me. Right now you are like a gnat buzzing around with no purpose and no value. get me donnie boy.

That's Mr. Yeldarb to you pilsbury dough boy. Please position you fat flaps in the upright and locked position as we are about to take off. Sorry to dissapoint you but I will be away from my computer for a few days. Hope someone will step up and keep the humours insults coming during my absence. (I am flying to Vegas and guess what? I only have to pay for one seat.)

Bradley (AKA YELDARB,)

You sure failed to save some money on that flight. With your lack of a functional brain, you could have flown for free by impersonating someone's luggage.

Tatter, now if that isn't a name of an obease person, I don't know what one is.....

Im back home now and very anxious to share my flight experience with all. No pat downs for me or anyone near me but when we made a stop at nashville, a whole herd of heffers boarded. They were spilling over into everyone else's seats and half of them were being towed, I mean pushed in wheel chairs, only because they were too fat to walk. They couldn't even sit down fast enough to prevent them from eating during the big walk from the front of the plane to their seat. You should have seen their pat downs. They had to find an NBA team in order to find humans with long enough arms to reach anywhere near around them. They could have been hiding a whole team of terrorists just between their thighs or butt cheeks. We definitely pushed the laws of physics trying to get that plane off the ground. We had to get a push start, use extra rocket boosters, fly into the wind, put on extra engines, and a whole team of pigeons before the pilot would even risk the take off attempt. They made us land in a field of jello once the flight tower saw just how much the belly of the plane had sagged while we were in flight. We were out of snacks for the whole flight even before we left the ground. But, I love flying with fat folks as they make great cushions should we crash.

yeldard:

@!$%# fuk @!$%# @!$%# @!$%# @!$%#ing @!$%# @!$%#

Must have struck a nerve and you all know what that means don't you?WinterSnows is probably more the size of Shelly Winters.

why yes I am .

what size are you?

6' 2" roughly 220lbs with a 36" waist. According to a "slim fast" chart I saw a few years ago, I am overweight also. But what I am seeing on a regular basis now is. Extremely fat obese bastards all claiming they are handicapped instead of admitting they are lazy and should be doing something about it. As it relates to this article, they need to at least fit totally inside of the seat and area that they paid for. It is a crisis all across America where everyone thinks they belong to the FBI (Fat, Bastards, Incorporated)

Yeldarb 27

you probably should weigh much less according to the charts. Why are you fat? Do you have an eating disorder? Are you an emotional eater? Are you lazy. You are lucky you are tall-if you were shorter it would be harder to fit that food in there. What are fat obese people bastards? DOn't they know who their fathers are, or are you just saying that adopted fat people are liars? In any case this about the new security measures, pat downs and scans. What does that have to do with being fat? Or are you a self hating lazy fat obese person who just can't come to terms? If so, maybe fat obese adopted people for fatter flying would help you manage your self-hating and mean spirited behaviors? I guess you just find it so frustrating being you that you take it out on others? Maybe there is an exercise or a pill or something for that. Maybe you could cut out meat, or carbs, or veggies, or everything from the hemlock family? It might improve your sour mean outlook--awww poor baby.

I was worried there. I have never seen a man so obsessed with size. I was going to recommend some of the late night products I see. Ext-something or other if that is the real ROOT of your problem with sizes of other people.

I have no problem admitting that according to "SlimFast" charts I am over weight. I am perfectly happy with my size (in all areas). But, at my age, middle aged, I should be looking for a thinner body in myself. Up until about age 40, I power lifted and still maintain quite a bit of muscle mass and size. The problem is...your heart doesn't know if it is pumping blood to feed fat or muscle. It is all the same burden to it. Due to my muscle mass (calorie burn rate is higher) I can eat much more than others and still maintain my fitness. But now as I approach 50, I will have to think more of my heart and go ahead and drop about 20lbs to feel better and lighter. Do you think any of you other fat bastards will do the same or just blame their "Jabba the Hut", Sharpie looking bodies that smell and intrude on the general public's space and welfare tax burdened society, will ever get of their fat asses and do something about it. But then again, maybe Walmart will just order more electric carts so they don't hurt any of these "self-handicapped" individuals feelings. Attn: ALL PETA people. Ever wonder how many whole flocks of turkeys have to be sacrificed just for Shelly Winters here, to enjoy Thanksgiving? Driving them to extinction is my bet.